This commentary will be in two parts due to its length, sorry!

Wg

This is an open commentary, meant for anyone to read but not meant to be addressed to anyone in particular. Just an open comment that I thought might bring in other thoughts along the line. Feel free to chime in your thoughts also, the more the merrier or the more knowledge we can obtain on the subject.

A thought came to mind about what people associated to the electrical industry considers as to what is safe. The NEC and other Code books and their affiliates believe that their Code is right. However when we explore throughout the world the Codes also explore throughout that same world. The end product seems to be a variety of opinions, books, Codes, and Laws declaring in that certain area as minimum safety parimeters.

If you read in depth the legal beagles and judges get so confused in trying to make a judicial ruling as to what was supposed to be safe pertaining to a certain situation that experienced property damage, or personal injury. The more experts in the field he hears on the subject in just one hearing for judicial review would boggle the mind. How on earth can that judge, who hires and electrician to do his work at home because he knows he doesn't know what safe is, how can he know what safe is in his judicial authority when he as a dozen different books, Codes, experts, etc. telling him totally different limitations as to what safe is.

Then you get the normal DIYer, he listens to the same level and variety of what safe is. He get confused and steps back into the safety of deciding himself what safe is because everyone else chimed in their opinions to the point that that DIYer has doubts in them all. Then that same DIYer plays it safe and installs what he thinks is safe, yet he knows that he, himself don't know.

A long time instructor friend of mine Tom Henry said in many seminars and classes I attended that he taught "How do you know what safe is unless you know what is considered as the minimum safety standards to be? His thoughts were toward the NEC minimum safety standards that he was teaching at the time. However over the years we find Canada, Europe, and many more countries even towns like Chicago have their own version as to what safe is.

Then we experience many different Electrical Inspectors and find as many different views or interprtations as to what the minimum safety standards are. This subject can keep going till we are all 200 years old and still we will find a new minimum safety standard in a new area.

Can't their be just one minimum safety standard, only one NEC, Only one Building Code, Only one Fire safety code and so on?

It has come to my opinion that as long as we have freedom of speech, freedom of mind, and freedom to disagree, we will go on and on and on with new versions as to what safe is.

AIN'T IT GREAT?

Wg

Continued on next reply:

re: WHAT IS SAFE, DO WE REALLY KNOW?	Warren Goodrich	4:05 pm wednesday october 3, 2001

Continued from main post. by Wg

I for one, respect others right to have an opinion. I also respect others right to do on their own land to do what they wish, just don't forget you may sell that property to someone who doesn't know whether you wired safely or not, they are also staking their lives on what you did when they buy your home that you wired. I just feel the we should demand that what you do on your land does not adversely affect others that may come into contact with you or trust you to know what safe is.

By law in my area, the electrical inspector decides legally as to what is right and safe, electrically. He is the AHJ. You say well he doesn't know. If that is true then vote out the people that put him in office and vote in someone who will represent you and appoint the electrical inspector that you want and that will pass you. Oops, there are a lot of you around. The electrical inspector may not be a popular position to have. Yet that electrical inspector has all the people in his jurisdiction to be responsible to ensure their safety, he should have been appointed due to his reputation and examples knowledge concerning electrical safety. That inspectors job is to ensure safety, provide information as to what you can do, not necessarily what you cant do. He is your source of information. He has been appointed by the people you voted into office to represent you and ensure your safety.

Now comes in the politics. I wonder how many electrical inspectors got fired or replaced because he rejected an inspection on one wrong person. I wonder how many electrical inspectors were ignored because a home owner did not want to mess with him, or because that home owner felt he knew more about what is safe than that inspector does. If this latter is the case then maybe you should talk to your elected officials. I am lucky along that line, most people feel free to ask me questions, and the Elected Officials definitly show their support concerning my rulings as the AHJ.

Just remember that when you take it upon yourself to ignore testing labs, electrical inspectors, fire inspectors and the like that are all "authority having jurisdictions". Then you have just taken full responsibility for your actions. If someone or something gets hurt because you didn't know that you didn't know then remember it was your decision. If you have an Electrical Inspector's Certificate of Occupancy or inspection approval, then you have the best defense available to present to that judge regardless of what all those experts told the judge. You wired as the AHJ ordered and approved your wiring to be done. If you have that inspection approval from the AHJ you are protected whether he knew what he was doing or not.

Just remember that you can pay home owner's insurance for twenty or more year and have one fire and that insurance company may not have to pay a dime in insurance recovery because you didn't have that AHJ's approval for what you did.

Do the best you know how and obtain that inspection approval from your Authority Having Jurisdiction, then sleep well at night knowing you did the best you knew how and with pride.

I tend to believe that Tom Henry had a good question when he asked in his class "How do you know what safe is if you don't know what the minimium safety standards are." I suspect that you will know what safe is if you know what the minimum safety standards are, then when you wire more than the minimum, you know how much more than safe you are.

Be safe, we care

Wg

re: WHAT IS SAFE, DO WE REALLY KNOW?	wirenuts	5:39 pm wednesday october 3, 2001

It would seem that safety is balanced opposite a $$$ on the scales of commerce to me. Safety is big biz, and in my experience, full of biz related bias. Do not take me as being against any safety standards,as I am not. I simply try to view what 'comes down the pike' objectively. There are many frustrations with safety issues that could take up volumes here.

If your firmly connected with the electrical trade, and keep an ear to your states political shenanigans regarding it's regulation of it, you see what 'lip service' is all about.

If you've messed around with the NRTL's you realize how overbearing beuaracracy's can baffle a NY lawyer with BS

If you've been amused at the poor workmanship of any particular widget, only to realize that 1/2 the CMP is comprised of manufacturer's you loose faith in the system

If you've been subjected to OHSA standards that actually are self- defeating in thier implimentation, it bums you out.